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Gospel Of Thomas... Discussion?

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"And you will find rest for yourselves"

Not just his presence. You will find rest is a reference to his ability to help you.

rest/stillness /void=form.

To find realization.

 

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"And you will find rest for yourselves"

Not just his presence. You will find rest is a reference to his ability to help you.

rest/stillness /void=form.

To find realization.

 

out of curiosity and wonder if my interpretation is right what is rest/stillness/void=form ?

Other than form if that is reffering to life. Where is the mother aspect referred to usually as shakti?

And what is the thing realized? Is it your quote about rest and form?

From an energetic standpoint i sense things die and come to life out of ones self. How or if it materilaizes physically that way i dont know.  

So can make some sense of what your saying. But if thats what your really saying i dont know?

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Moving on,

 
90. Jesus said, "Come to me, for my yoke is comfortable and my lordship is gentle, and you will find rest for yourselves."

From my perspective, this one is about being a Christ (and also to an extent a true guru). When one forms a true guru connection with such a being, an energy bond forms. That bond creates a yoke of purification and Jesus is stating that his approach (lordship) is gentle. And with the ongoing relationship and increased clarity you will find peace (rest).

 

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"And you will find rest for yourselves"

Not just his presence. You will find rest is a reference to his ability to help you.

rest/stillness /void=form.

To find realization.

 

out of curiosity and wonder if my interpretation is right what is rest/stillness/void=form ?

Other than form if that is reffering to life. Where is the mother aspect referred to usually as shakti?

And what is the thing realized? Is it your quote about rest and form?

From an energetic standpoint i sense things die and come to life out of ones self. How or if it materilaizes physically that way i dont know.  

So can make some sense of what your saying. But if thats what your really saying i dont know?

Sorry running I was getting a little cryptic.

Void=Form and Form=Void is from the Heart Sutra.

The Father aspect is the void, silence or stillness. Jesus in other lines of the gospel calls it rest.

The Mother is motion, energy.. all that is, is form. Is the Mother.

I was saying that Jesus will help one realize that form and emptiness are the same. That they are said void and form.

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Moving on,

 91. They said to him, "Tell us who you are so that we may believe in you." He said to them, "You examine the face of heaven and earth, but you have not come to know the one who is in your presence, and you do not know how to examine the present moment."

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"And you will find rest for yourselves"

Not just his presence. You will find rest is a reference to his ability to help you.

rest/stillness /void=form.

To find realization.

 

out of curiosity and wonder if my interpretation is right what is rest/stillness/void=form ?

Other than form if that is reffering to life. Where is the mother aspect referred to usually as shakti?

And what is the thing realized? Is it your quote about rest and form?

From an energetic standpoint i sense things die and come to life out of ones self. How or if it materilaizes physically that way i dont know.  

So can make some sense of what your saying. But if thats what your really saying i dont know?

 

Sorry running I was getting a little cryptic.

Void=Form and Form=Void is from the Heart Sutra.

The Father aspect is the void, silence or stillness. Jesus in other lines of the gospel calls it rest.

The Mother is motion, energy.. all that is, is form. Is the Mother.

I was saying that Jesus will help one realize that form and emptiness are the same. That they are said void and form.

thanks for explaining. I knew what you meant until i start over analyzing. Lol.

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Moving on,

 91. They said to him, "Tell us who you are so that we may believe in you." He said to them, "You examine the face of heaven and earth, but you have not come to know the one who is in your presence, and you do not know how to examine the present moment."

i think he is just trying to say his presence can help them.

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Moving on,

 91. They said to him, "Tell us who you are so that we may believe in you." He said to them, "You examine the face of heaven and earth, but you have not come to know the one who is in your presence, and you do not know how to examine the present moment."

I love this line. This one really shows that Jesus was telling people to look inward to quite the mind.

You have been looking for someone to show you heaven and when he is right in front of you, you don't see him. Nor do you understand the present moment aka Rigpa.

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Moving on,

92. Jesus said, "Seek and you will find. In the past, however, I did not tell you the things about which you asked me then. Now I am willing to tell them, but you are not seeking them."

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Moving on,

92. Jesus said, "Seek and you will find. In the past, however, I did not tell you the things about which you asked me then. Now I am willing to tell them, but you are not seeking them."

not enough context for me to comment on. 

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Maybe this is talking about the change Jesus made, and how now since it is easier to grow he would like more seekers to come

but no one is listening. 

Next one.

93. "Don't give what is holy to dogs, for they might throw them upon the manure pile. Don't throw pearls [to] pigs, or they might ... it [...]."

This one could be talking about why some teaching systems kept their knowledge secret. If one were to just give out these things to everyone

(to those not seeking) then it would receive the same amount of attention from them that they give everything else. Treating a goldmine like

an outhouse with ignorance as the paint. Back in the day, old timey rituals would reflect on the outside the inside of the teachings. Conveying

a sense of grandeur that helps the seeker understand the value of the teachings.

Edited by Qibrush

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Moving on,

92. Jesus said, "Seek and you will find. In the past, however, I did not tell you the things about which you asked me then. Now I am willing to tell them, but you are not seeking them."

In this verse, Jesus is speaking from the perspective of being one with God. As the gospels say, if one seeks, they shall find, but human potential (or the level of possible realization while in human form) is constantly evolving. To me, he is saying that "in the past" I (God) did not tell you or humans did not have the capability for some things, but now that the new covenant (turning) has come, the potential exists, and no one is paying attention or truly seeking it.

 

Maybe this is talking about the change Jesus made, and how now since it is easier to grow he would like more seekers to come

but no one is listening. 

Next one.

93. "Don't give what is holy to dogs, for they might throw them upon the manure pile. Don't throw pearls [to] pigs, or they might ... it [...]."

This one could be talking about why some teaching systems kept their knowledge secret. If one were to just give out these things to everyone

(to those not seeking) then it would receive the same amount of attention from them that they give everything else. Treating a goldmine like

an outhouse with ignorance as the paint. Back in the day, old timey rituals would reflect on the outside the inside of the teachings. Conveying

a sense of grandeur that helps the seeker understand the value of the teachings.

Very well said. Also, in many cases, some people are just not ready for certain teachings. Like if one cannot yet feel "energy", how will they be able to comprehend and have faith in such practices. In ego self defense, they are more likely to treat it like that outhouse you are describing. :) 

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Moving on,

92. Jesus said, "Seek and you will find. In the past, however, I did not tell you the things about which you asked me then. Now I am willing to tell them, but you are not seeking them."

In this verse, Jesus is speaking from the perspective of being one with God. As the gospels say, if one seeks, they shall find, but human potential (or the level of possible realization while in human form) is constantly evolving. To me, he is saying that "in the past" I (God) did not tell you or humans did not have the capability for some things, but now that the new covenant (turning) has come, the potential exists, and no one is paying attention or truly seeking it.

 

Maybe this is talking about the change Jesus made, and how now since it is easier to grow he would like more seekers to come

but no one is listening. 

Next one.

93. "Don't give what is holy to dogs, for they might throw them upon the manure pile. Don't throw pearls [to] pigs, or they might ... it [...]."

This one could be talking about why some teaching systems kept their knowledge secret. If one were to just give out these things to everyone

(to those not seeking) then it would receive the same amount of attention from them that they give everything else. Treating a goldmine like

an outhouse with ignorance as the paint. Back in the day, old timey rituals would reflect on the outside the inside of the teachings. Conveying

a sense of grandeur that helps the seeker understand the value of the teachings.

Very well said. Also, in many cases, some people are just not ready for certain teachings. Like if one cannot yet feel "energy", how will they be able to comprehend and have faith in such practices. In ego self defense, they are more likely to treat it like that outhouse you are describing. :) 

quibrush and jeff thanks! It sounded to me from reading it to be what jeff just said. But i wasnt sure. I kinda disagree about us as everybody evolving and more ready in some way later in time than before. But i have no way of knowing either way. Perhaps thats true. I just think its individual. But again i dont know?

But it feels to me we were way more advanced in much earlier years. I know for me going through my personal life experiences as the process happens all i can recall is lives of war for perhaps the last couple thousands of years or so.But growing spiritualy in them from the difficult circumstances. In the oneness of my environment and my intuition. Also from the huge surrendering involved in those kinda circumstances. Not that i like it. I dont. But it is what it is and thats what it did for me the best that i can tell.

Going back much further i have recalled feeling like i had an incredible spiritual life or lives. The training was like nothing i can find. But im sure it has a lot of similiaritys to what is available today. That is meditating from very early in life. According to my intuition from knee high. So thats pretty young i think. Having a human teacher who's sole purpose is to teach and guide people the arts. He i think saw and taught life as like a story of beauty but not something you are attached to like people normaly are. The meditations were very long and involved a great deal of concentration. They were done in caves that were set up for this. Involved the use of minerals such as crystals and so on. He could read your future life times like a book. I say that because i some what remember feeling him expressing my future lives and its hardships. It felt all due to attachments towards things that needed to be released. So thats what happend. And it is good cause it did and is. But then it felt scary where i was going. And i remember feeling the sympathy back about it.

 

Edited by running
Reworded for context and added

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Very cool to hear running. From my own kind of knowing I believe the universe is constantly evolving, but same,

I don't really know yet :D. That last one seems straightforward . How about the next one?

94. Jesus [said], "One who seeks will find, and for [one who knocks] it will be opened."

The first part could be talking about how if you look for the truth you will find it in some way. I'm not sure about

the second part. Maybe if one asks they will receive.

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Very cool to hear running. From my own kind of knowing I believe the universe is constantly evolving, but same,

I don't really know yet :D. That last one seems straightforward . How about the next one?

94. Jesus [said], "One who seeks will find, and for [one who knocks] it will be opened."

The first part could be talking about how if you look for the truth you will find it in some way. I'm not sure about

the second part. Maybe if one asks they will receive.

The second part is really similar to the first. It is just another analogy.  When one "knocks", they are taking action to "open", kind of the same as seeking. :)

 

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Thank you Jeff,

Moving to the next one.

95. [Jesus said], "If you have money, don't lend it at interest. Rather, give [it] to someone from whom you won't get it back."

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I think he is showing the way to an open heart.

Selfless service. Give for the act of giving. Not for what you want or what you can get out of it.

Closer to the truth would be to exchange money for love.

Love unconditionally.

Edited by Tom

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Good one Tom :) 

Maybe more specifically it could also be talking about a master student relationship. How the

master gives hoping the student will take and use it all. 

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I agree with both Tom and Qibrush here.

A true master is not a master at all without an open heart

As a true master giving to a student is an act of selflessness.

Is it a true gift if there is an expectation of a pay off in some manner? No, no it is not.

 

... if you see a need and you can fulfill that need, do so.

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Moving on,

96. Jesus [said], "The Father's kingdom is like [a] woman. She took a little leaven, [hid] it in dough, and made it into large loaves of bread. Anyone here with two ears had better listen!"

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Seems this verse is speaking of growth or change, in that it only takes a sprinkling of the Gospel to initiate it. One should always pay attention and seek the Gospel, or perhaps truth.

 

My two cents...

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Very nice.

This reminds me of this verse:

3. Jesus said, "If your leaders say to you, 'Look, the (Father's) kingdom is in the sky,' then the birds of the sky will precede you. If they say to you, 'It is in the sea,' then the fish will precede you. Rather, the (Father's) kingdom is within you and it is outside you. When you know yourselves, then you will be known, and you will understand that you are children of the living Father. But if you do not know yourselves, then you live in poverty, and you are the poverty."

I think he is saying the same thing. The kingdom is within you and outside of you...

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Very nice.

This reminds me of this verse:

3. Jesus said, "If your leaders say to you, 'Look, the (Father's) kingdom is in the sky,' then the birds of the sky will precede you. If they say to you, 'It is in the sea,' then the fish will precede you. Rather, the (Father's) kingdom is within you and it is outside you. When you know yourselves, then you will be known, and you will understand that you are children of the living Father. But if you do not know yourselves, then you live in poverty, and you are the poverty."

I think he is saying the same thing. The kingdom is within you and outside of you...

doesnt get better than that!  Thanks for sharing this one

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